From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Fri Jan  7 07:16:17 2000
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From:   "bis" <bis@gateway.net>
To:     <linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org>
Subject: How Red Hat Linux 6.0 handles memory. To me it looks like a disaster
Date:   Fri, 7 Jan 2000 01:11:33 -0600
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 Dear Linux Team,

 I have little hope that somebody will be so kind to answer but I have
unpleasant experience with memory
using 2.2.5-15smp Kernel. Red Hat Linux 6.0.

Whatever I do my free memory always shrinks.
I have around 1GB of memory. Everything works
looked fine. But then I found unpleasant surprise.
I run large program (which fits into RAM nicely)
and then run

 free or vmstat

 I always observe reduction on memory. I also run
Apache on the machine. If I try to retrieve a page
from my website on that machine I always loose
memory. It goes in to cash or shared memory but
free memory ALWAYS SHRINKS. And I don't understand why. I think the only
possible explanation
is kernel behavior. To me it's absolutely unsatisfactory. Sometimes during
HTML page retrieval
(just when I click a browser) it reduces by 200 KB.
Hardly believable? But it's true. And it's reproducible.
Sometimes it reduces only by 4 KB. But whatever
I do it always shrinks. At the same time I planned
to run two big programs in parallel which consume
300-400 M of memory. However, after each run I always get 30-40 M reduction
in free memory. (From
my point of view free memory is maximum memory
you can allocate from you program). This situation
looks pretty much disastrous since rather quickly
when the memory will be as low as 700M the system
will start swapping and will further reduce free memory
in the system. I observe all this already for 4 months.
And I don't like it. Even if I run something pretty small
I still get effective memory reduction.

 I find all this highly unsatisfactory. And I don't understand why people
consider kernel 2.2.5-15smp
as being stable. I understand that there perhaps a certain algorithm in
kernel which redistributes the
memory. But I don't like this behavior I can hardly
do anything about it. The loss of memory accessible
from the programs diminishes very rapidly. Sometimes
10-20 M per day. Though my machine is almost empty.
And it's not clear whether it's possible or not to stop
this process. Maybe it will stabilize maybe not. Maybe
I will be forced to reboot every day... I don't understand why people are so
happy about latest versions of Linux... Could you do something about it?
For me all this is just equivalent to a huge memory
leak. Could you please tell me what shall I do?
My system was installed by Dell (as well as Apache)
and everything appears to run smoothly but this
problem with memory makes me really sick.

 Could please improve the kernel or give me some
explanation of what is going on? If I don't reboot
my machine for a month I easily me loose 150M or
more of memory. I agree with you that this is probably
not a real memory leak... But my inability to influence
distribution of memory by kernel makes me helpless.

Could someone give at least a hint of what is going
on? I would be very grateful to that person.

 Regards, Boris


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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Fri Jan  7 15:35:39 2000
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From:	Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
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To:	bis <bis@gateway.net>
cc:	linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: Re: How Red Hat Linux 6.0 handles memory. To me it looks like a
 disaster
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On Fri, 7 Jan 2000, bis wrote:

> Whatever I do my free memory always shrinks.

This is an FAQ, somebody should document this...
(one of the other Linux-MM folks please)

- free memory is wasted memory, the Linux kernel will try
  to use system memory as effectively as possible
- Linux uses a unified memory pool, that means that all
  memory can be used for everything (kernel structures,
  buffers, cache or user memory)
- when there is free memory, the kernel will use it to
  cache data from disk
- when there is a shortage of memory, the kernel will
  free some of that cache and/or swap out programs

There is no memory leak or whatever going on, it's just the
kernel using memory to its fullest potential. It is true,
however, that the 2.2 memory reclamation algorithm is not
the most effective, that algorithm has improved a lot in
2.3 (and will be in kernel 2.4 when it comes out later this
year).

regards,

Rik
--
The Internet is not a network of computers. It is a network
of people. That is its real strength.

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Archive:      http://humbolt.nl.linux.org/lists/
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan  8 00:02:24 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm mm-links.html
Message-Id: <20000107230144Z92172-16914+113@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Sat, 8 Jan 2000 00:01:40 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv23861

Modified Files:
	mm-links.html 
Log Message:
dlmalloc added

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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Mon Jan 10 07:33:22 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm index.html people.html
Message-Id: <20000110063249Z92194-29582+4@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Mon, 10 Jan 2000 07:32:47 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv988

Modified Files:
	index.html people.html 
Log Message:
bigphysarea news added

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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Thu Jan 13 21:21:01 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm todo.html
Message-Id: <20000113202025Z92219-19445+65@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv19282

Modified Files:
	todo.html 
Log Message:
things that were done years ago deleted
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Fri Jan 14 00:23:12 2000
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From:   Kelly Alexander <kelly@nvidia.com>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: 1+ GB support
Date:   Thu, 13 Jan 2000 15:19:00 -0800
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	I've read a bunch of linux news that says that the later kernels
such as 2.3.35 can support more than 1gb of memory.  I've put together a
system with 4gb of RAM (dell 6300, 2x PIII 550 xeon CPUs) and can see that
the kernel reports all 4gb is there and I can use 4gb if running multiple
processes.  However, I've been unable to malloc and use more than 1gb per
process.  Is this a limitation or am I doing something wrong?  I've tried to
use the obsolete FAQ on large memory to give me some ideas of where to poke
around but no luck so far.  Any ideas or pointers for me to investigate?

---
Kelly Alexander
nVidia Corporation    
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Tue Jan 18 11:51:45 2000
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From:   Marcel Harkema <marcel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm mm-links.html
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv31932/linux-mm

Modified Files:
	mm-links.html 
Log Message:
* Add 'Design Elements of the FreeBSD VM System' link.
* Update UVM link description.


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To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm mm-links.html
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv32018/linux-mm

Modified Files:
	mm-links.html 
Log Message:
* Oops, updated layout for new link.


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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Tue Jan 18 12:06:49 2000
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From:   Marcel Harkema <marcel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm mm-links.html
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv426/linux-mm

Modified Files:
	mm-links.html 
Log Message:
* Add links to SunOS VM papers.


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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 22:16:29 2000
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	Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:15:48 +0100
From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm mm-links.html
Message-Id: <20000122211551Z92194-29430+66@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:15:48 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv13929

Modified Files:
	mm-links.html 
Log Message:
links back into alphabetic order
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 22:20:39 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm mm-links.html
Message-Id: <20000122211957Z92208-29430+67@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:19:55 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv14191

Modified Files:
	mm-links.html 
Log Message:
address changed; it's also _really_ in alphabetical order now
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 22:24:39 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm mm-links.html
Message-Id: <20000122212402Z92194-29430+68@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:23:50 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv14430

Modified Files:
	mm-links.html 
Log Message:
finally sorted out
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 22:39:18 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm index.html internals.html kernel-links.html linux-mm.html mm-links.html patches.html people.html todo.html
Message-Id: <20000122213847Z92194-29430+70@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:38:39 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv15233

Modified Files:
	index.html internals.html kernel-links.html linux-mm.html 
	mm-links.html patches.html people.html todo.html 
Log Message:
CVS $ added
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 22:46:59 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm index.html internals.html kernel-links.html linux-mm.html mm-links.html patches.html people.html todo.html
Message-Id: <20000122214620Z92194-29430+71@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:46:15 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv15635

Modified Files:
	index.html internals.html kernel-links.html linux-mm.html 
	mm-links.html patches.html people.html todo.html 
Log Message:
better not in bold, also fixed minor things in other pages
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 23:03:19 2000
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	Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:57:50 +0100
From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm internals.html linux-mm.html mm-links.html patches.html people.html
Message-Id: <20000122215922Z92194-29430+74@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
Date:   Sat, 22 Jan 2000 22:57:50 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv16290

Modified Files:
	internals.html linux-mm.html mm-links.html patches.html 
	people.html 
Log Message:
last layout nitpicks
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 23:18:32 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm todo.html
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Date:   Sat, 22 Jan 2000 23:14:32 +0100
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv17049

Modified Files:
	todo.html 
Log Message:
todo list updated, more or less
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sat Jan 22 23:41:47 2000
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From:   Rik van Riel <riel@nl.linux.org>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: [CVS] humbolt:/linux-mm index.html
Message-Id: <20000122223844Z92207-29430+79@humbolt.nl.linux.org>
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Update of /home/CVS/linux-mm
In directory humbolt:/tmp/cvs-serv18252

Modified Files:
	index.html 
Log Message:
IRC channel #kernelnewbies added to news
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Tue Jan 25 22:02:22 2000
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From:   "Darren_Mclain" <a1bmclain@mail.codenet.net>
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Subject: Linux memory management
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To "The Team",
 
I am a student at Regis University in Colorado.  Currently, I am doing research on the topic of physical memory management in Linux.  I am having some troubles finding reliable sources with "meaty" content.  Do you have any suggestions?  I would greatly appreciate any information that you could provide.  Please direct your response to a1bmclain@codenet.net.  Thank you for your time.
 
Andy McLain
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From owner-linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org Sun Jan 30 18:06:18 2000
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Date:   30 Jan 00 10:02:49 MST
From:   sarnath kannan <intel386@usa.net>
To:     linux-mm-www@nl.linux.org
Subject: a doubt !!!
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HI Guys,

I came across ur web-page...Nice to see that...
I want to know more about the entire memory arch..,
(Like .. Page tables..,Page direc...,VM.. and how 
they all have been put together....)Can u suggest
me a site where i can get all these things ..
Thanks in advance..

With lots of linux luv,
Sarnath.k

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